[SPEC] Encouraging HTTP Proxies to support Gemini hosts self-blacklisting

Nathan Galt mailinglists at ngalt.com
Wed Feb 24 00:14:36 GMT 2021



> On Feb 23, 2021, at 11:19 AM, Bradley D. Thornton <Bradley at NorthTech.US> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> On 2/22/2021 6:21 PM, Jason McBrayer wrote:
>> 
>> Dave Cottlehuber writes:
>>> 403 Forbidden is ideal for this, or one of the 50x error codes. In
>>> practice most systems will retry a 50x request but not a 403.
>> 
>> I feel that by analogy, status code 418 might be appropriate.
>> 
> 
> 
> And certainly, my specific intent here is not to stymie that sort of
> vehicle. My beef, is I don't want any of the unique content that I
> publish in Gopher space or Gemini space leaking to HTTP space. I just
> loathe the thought of that - What purpose does Gopher or Gemini have
> where the client side is concerned if it's just going to be published in
> HTML.
[snip]
> I have wanted to believe that I can incorporate copyright law into the
> things that I personally wish to share with the world by using things
> like the GPL v2 (and in some instances the AGPL) or with a CC-BY-SA. But
> this matter has me questioning if that's going to afford others (and
> myself) the protections I choose for my works.
> 
> Do I need to do something like "Copyright 2021 all rights reserved?" or
> will simply racheting things up a little bit to a CC-BY-ND legally
> protect my intellectual property from being converted into HTML?
> 
> And what about the other user agents? Search engines like Gus and
> Houston? Will they think that maybe they shouldn't crawl and index
> servers that state that webproxies aren't welcome - I certainly don't
> wish for that to happen, those are not simply valuable services to the
> community, but in the coming years they're going to be vital.
> 
> And what about the archiver agetns? are they going to store their
> results in space that includes HTTP servers?
> 
> It's potentially a whole can "O" worms.
> 
> My position is quite simple. I don't want ANYONE to be able to read,
> surf or access content on Vger from a web browser via HTTP protocol.
> This of course, excludes plugins like Geminize, because the user is
> actually using native Gemini protocol to access Gemini space.
> 
> Very simple concept to me. It makes Gopher more valuable. it makes
> Gemini more valuable (provided the content is worth visiting via the
> native protocols).
> 
> And I really don't want people to have to adhere to a "No Derivitive"
> clause in a creative commons license. I want them to be able to take my
> toys and edit them and share them with others in a form that suits the
> greater good (Yes, even if  that means they put that shit on a web
> server - they just have to retrieve it via Gemini or Gopher client).
> 
> I really don't know the answers to all of the questions that may raise,
> and maybe that's where the discussion should go, coz I don't see any
> roadblocks adressing this technically, or in a neighborly fashion. It's
> the people who choose an immoral approach that may beg of licensing and
> copyright discussions.

Standard disclaimer: I am very much not a lawyer.

While this won’t make you many friends online, it’s worth pointing out that you can get much further with a Disallow: line and a DMCA takedown request than you can with a Disallow: line alone.

That said, if the other party pushes back, you might end up having to pay lawyers to litigate novel caselaw regarding proxying of content. Then again, all this might’ve been settled by websites that put their banners on things and stick your site in an <iframe> in the middle of it all.


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